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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2017 13:07:35 GMT
Servers Are Transmitters
Up until now the subject of radio streaming has been put in the General Category, but because Stream Servers truly are Transmitters we should put the subject here.
Most of last week and all of this week KDX Radio is deeply under the hood with Icecast Streaming Server and we are learning a lot with always more that we do not yet understand.
Yesterday we encountered a configuration error that kept our stream silent most of the day.
Today we have learned that many many different radio feeds can be sent though a single Icecast Server.
Another bit of knowledge is that Icecast refers to encoders as "Source Clients".
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Post by thelegacy on Oct 11, 2017 19:36:55 GMT
Yup for example 127.0.0.1/thelegacyhigh for Mp3 streaming. /thelegacyhigh is your mountpoint. 127.0.0.1/thelegacylow can be AAC+ at 64Kb/s streaming. With Icecast V2 KH you can stream port 80 which means that even most firewalls will accept your Radio stream.
Icecast is great for CDN (Content Delivery Network) ad supported music stream which I've talked about in the lecture about streaming and Icecast along with NextKast as your Radio Automation.
Its funny how Winamp is totally geared towards Shoutcast but Radionomy actually uses Icecast V2 KH for many of its stations on their network. Plus Icecast is not so contained as Shoutcast V2 tries to be now. There is no special license requirements for Mp3's unlike the NEW 2.x version of Shoutcast.
This is why I'm a big Icecast supporter and in this stage of the game you need a content delivery Network to keep your station legally a float.
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Post by Druid Hills Radio on Oct 11, 2017 20:20:20 GMT
Yup for example 127.0.0.1/thelegacyhigh for Mp3 streaming. /thelegacyhigh is your mountpoint. 127.0.0.1/thelegacylow can be AAC+ at 64Kb/s streaming. With Icecast V2 KH you can stream port 80 which means that even most firewalls will accept your Radio stream. Icecast is great for CDN (Content Delivery Network) ad supported music stream which I've talked about in the lecture about streaming and Icecast along with NextKast as your Radio Automation. Its funny how Winamp is totally geared towards Shoutcast but Radionomy actually uses Icecast V2 KH for many of its stations on their network. Plus Icecast is not so contained as Shoutcast V2 tries to be now. There is no special license requirements for Mp3's unlike the NEW 2.x version of Shoutcast. This is why I'm a big Icecast supporter and in this stage of the game you need a content delivery Network to keep your station legally a float. Live365 uses Icecast also. 128K for now but heeding Carl's suggestion they are looking at lower bit-rates. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2017 22:42:42 GMT
Looking for How To InfoThe Icecast directory of stations is here dir.xiph.orgSome of the stations listed have an embedded Flash Player attached to their listing. What is the way of adding the Flash Player? I can't find the instructions.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2017 22:37:29 GMT
Moving On Down the Stream
Never mind my last question.
Upon close examination the Flash-like player that shows up on some of the Xiph Icecast Directory listings is produced by streamers using the Ogg Vorbis audio format. Therefore those of us sending mp3 do not qualify for the Flash-like Player.
What I Tried To Do Today
Trying to be smart I went searching for tutorial educational instruction about streaming.
What I find is companies offering equipment and software for top dollar, as well as the websites offering paid streaming services.
Where might someone find instructional information on the streaming subject?
Never mind YouTube, which has some pointlessly faulty videos.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2017 19:38:58 GMT
Anticipating the Next ALPB Meeting
For several meetings the ALPB has been preparing for a yet unscheduled seminar on streaming, which will probably be done in 3 or 4 parts coming from the real-world experience of members.
The stream industry, including paid web directories, software vendors and equipment manufacturers, have tooled-up big time to capitalize on this hot market. They would prefer that early adapters like us keep secret how we're able to stream for free or at reasonably low rates.
This thread was launched on top of my claim that stream servers are transmitters. That idea is solidly brought home by a picture on page 12 of October Radio Magazine showing a rack-sized device boldly labeled a Streaming Transmitter. I want lettering on my desktop computer that says the same thing!
Now my negative thoughts.
As we hear, many radio stations in the world are turning off their over-the-air transmitters and putting it all on line. As I see it this is a way of becoming lost in a massive crowd. Yet, on-the-air radio stations are being abandoned by the old crowd.
It could get lonely.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2017 20:12:25 GMT
Speaking To An Empty Theater
At least we have a theater, provided by The ALPB, here on the Forum.
This is also kind of a hospice for the once great low power radio hobby now attended by a handful of members with their antique transmitters broadcasting to the open space between four or five nearby houses.
With dogged faith in tomorrow four or five of us plan to bring a set of seminars on web streaming to the empty stage, mostly telling each other how to do something we are already doing.
Today I reached the conclusion that not everything the Icecast Server is able to do is described in the documentation and after wasting a lot of time watching awful YouTube "how to" videos and running failed experiments I happened upon a well hidden secret involving the VLC Media Player which can be used as an internet radio to scoop up a lot of information about existing Icecast radio stations.
The first thing I noticed is that many many stations are dishonest, listing themselves as "news" or "talk" stations when in fact they play music. This kind of unreliability will ultimately harm streaming popularity.
There is no internet equivalent of the FCC, the only regulatory agents watching online radio being music royalty predators poised to bring down small-time operators for music whose value is vastly overrated.
If an internet radio station were heard in a California forest would their be any listeners left unburned?
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Post by thelegacy on Oct 20, 2017 6:29:37 GMT
The problem that you brought up about improper jonra seems to also affects shoutcast streams as well.
Some of the small-time hobby stations seem to just set up their automation software give the station a name and fire it up and Let It Go without actually making sure that there is the proper jonra listed in the directory.
They count on social media and other things to actually promote their station. So some of them actually don't worry what's listed in the ice cast or shoutcast directory.
Speaking of the different shoutcast versions I think I mentioned before that I like version 1.9 point eight. Even though the newer version can actually do more there seems to be more bugs associated with the newer versions of shoutcast.
Icecast version 2 KH seems to be very good and stable. The only thing is their directory does not seem to have the genres listed quite as nicely.
I tried to look for classic rock and progressive rock exclusively in the icecast directory and had difficulties finding the stations that are playing just that.
I really think the problem comes down to this more people rely on directories like TuneIn to actually find the radio stations they are looking for. That makes a few of the radio station operators a little more lazy as far as being listed in shoutcast or the icecast directory.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2017 16:40:03 GMT
How Are You Doing That?I like the comments made by TheLegacy about lazy listings by many internet stations. You are right! My deep-dish probing into the Icecast streaming server has discovered a new trick... take a look at my server's Status Page and come back for more: KDX Icecast Status PageWhat did you just see? You saw TWO KDX streams neatly contained within a single status page! What's more both of those streams are passing through the SAME PORT from my computer. I found an Icecast webcaster that has 24 different streams all packed into a single instance of the Icecast server! There's almost nothing said in the documentation about the ability of multiplexing streams onto a single server. Also as part of the system KDX is using only one stream encoder to send both streams! Things are getting interesting.
Another Stream AddedNow there are 3 KDX Streams on 1-sever!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2017 15:13:23 GMT
I Am Really Into This
My entire perspective on webcasting has radically changed from negative to positive as a result of intensive analysis of what's being done by nearly 20,000 Icecast radio stations.
While previously believing that internet radio was made pointless by the sheer number of stations, such is no longer the case and I'll tell you why.
Taking days to listen to stations one by one we have found that the vast majority of the stations are transmitting popular music formats (i.e., rock, smooth jazz, metal, etc.) with no creative effort on the part of the operators. Being "popular" doesn't mean much if there are thousands of pop stations.
Culturally informed stations with meaningful talk and well hosted unique music are so few that now we are probably talking about fewer than a hundred stations! Plenty of room for KDX to step into the arena!
Seminars on web streaming coming up in the weeks ahead at ALPB meetings!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2017 22:27:57 GMT
The Floor Is Wet From All This Streaming
As 0f 5:22 PM this afternoon (CDT) KDX is sending TWO program streams, one of them has THREE BRANCHES in DIFFERENT FORMATS.
The Daily Main KDX Schedule is streaming from a Altacast Encoder in low and mid MP3 format AND in aac format.
A continuous loop of 6-hours and 46-minutes of TUC Radio Programs is being sent from a B.U.T.T. Encoder at 48 kbps.
I could sit here and keep adding more streams until winter comes and the geese fly south.
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Post by thelegacy on Oct 24, 2017 2:07:39 GMT
Be careful with how many streams you add if you're having the server at your own house. It'll suck your bandwidth down to nothing.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2017 3:30:05 GMT
Details and the Devil
TheLegacy splashes stream water on a few faces: "Be careful with how many streams you add if you're having the server at your own house."
Oh, I've been getting carried away.
Would it help if I had two houses?
Tomorrow will be stream reduction day.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2017 15:04:44 GMT
A Streaming Experiment
Many of our stations on these forums utilize Zara as the center of program operations.
KDX uses Zara together with Virtual Cable, LineIn Plugin, and Winamp to give the added benefit of the Winamp DSP Sidechain, which connects to StereoTool and Altacast Encoder.
Altacast Encoder is set to send both a wide-bandwidth (40 kbps) and narrow bandwidth (8 kbps) to an Icecast Server, making KDX Programming available to listeners with either good or poor internet service.
None of that is the "experiment" I'm just about to describe.
We looked at the four Aux Audio Channels available within Zara, and placed a sequential audio file containing 8-hours of TUC Radio programs into Aux 4, setting it to repeat, and patched the output to a B.U.T.T. Encoder sending 32 kbps to a 3rd Icecast Mountpoint within the single server.
In this way KDX was equipped with a Main Channel and a Sub-Carrier, sending two sets of programs at the same time.
The arrangement was very stable and utilized 33% of the computer's CPU.
Running other applications on the same computer, such as audio editing, video viewing, or general browsing and downloading, can cause jitters in the broadcast streams, but never a failure.
Obviously many listener connections would further burden the system and it certainly would be advisable to move as much traffic as possible to a second computer.
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Post by Boomer on Nov 4, 2017 0:02:27 GMT
I use VU Player, it's a low feature player that I saw was being used in a low power station long ago, they showed their screen and talked about it so I went and got it. I found it to be great for my use, and live assist it's even better.
It's no frills, no jingle player, auto feed pickup, or DSPs but it does have intelligent auto-crossfade, count up and count down track timers, repeat track, and repeat playlist. No special file formats or adjusting files, or adding tags, gaps or overlaps to them is needed.
Items at my station don't need to run on any schedule, and I don't care about top of the hour IDs like in the corporate world, so VU Player suits me fine. I can also pipe it to a streamer or pipeline as needed.
Boomer
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