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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 10, 2017 3:07:20 GMT
Got it. Thanks again. Number of ConductorsThe question: " In the drawing I see no references to "2-conductor" and "1-conductor" audio cable as per your initial instructions, just 3-conductor." I suspect that I have not used consistent language to describe the number of conductors in each of my posts. There are center conductors and the shield is a conductor. In the short unbalanced line from the computer to the mixer there are "two cables in one" since the left and right channel each have a center conductor sharing a common ground-shield conductor; 3-total conductors. From the mixer to the Line Amp is a mono cable with 1 center conductor and the ground-shield conductor; 2-total conductors. From the balanced output of the Line Amp is a two-center conductor (+)(-) mono balanced with ground-shield for a total of 3-conductors. If that's confusing I'll be out of town for about 3-years, all my calls will be taken by End 80 or Mark.
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Post by Boomer on May 10, 2017 11:04:26 GMT
Hey Carl, do you have a graphics program? This might be a case where the tutorial is done through the addition of helpful graphics along with the text.
You could use Paint in Windows, or even sketch it on paper and take a photo or scan it.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2017 11:40:36 GMT
We Arrived Here At the Same Time
Boomer suggests: "You could use Paint in Windows, or even sketch it on paper and take a photo or scan it."
Happy to say to Boomer that we just did draw the audio config on a large sheet of paper and it's back a few posts in this thread!
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Post by Boomer on May 11, 2017 11:34:34 GMT
Carl, I missed that, going straight to the last page here, but thanks, diagrams supported by text work well for learning.
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 14, 2017 1:06:08 GMT
Here is an update. I wired the mixer as per Carl's instructions. I then wired the amp. I received the power supply in the mail yesterday. I just did the final hookup and noticed the power supply puts out 24 vdc and the STA-1 spec sheet calls for 12-15 vdc. Also the PS states that the line with the white stripe is positive. Well neither line has a white stripe, both are solid black so I cut off the connector and used my DMM to determine polarity. Anyway, everything hooked up, on my bench, and all I get on the radio is very loud 60 cycle hum. I'm done for today but I have a couple dozen power supplies laying around my shop so tomorrow I will look for one with a lower voltage output. That said, I'm not sure the PS is the problem. Does anyone know if you use the pro audio input that you must also use the power input on J5? I am still using the 5000's wall wart PS which I planned on housing in the enclosure when I mount it outside. Got it. Thanks again. Number of ConductorsThe question: " In the drawing I see no references to "2-conductor" and "1-conductor" audio cable as per your initial instructions, just 3-conductor." I suspect that I have not used consistent language to describe the number of conductors in each of my posts. There are center conductors and the shield is a conductor. In the short unbalanced line from the computer to the mixer there are "two cables in one" since the left and right channel each have a center conductor sharing a common ground-shield conductor; 3-total conductors. From the mixer to the Line Amp is a mono cable with 1 center conductor and the ground-shield conductor; 2-total conductors. From the balanced output of the Line Amp is a two-center conductor (+)(-) mono balanced with ground-shield for a total of 3-conductors. If that's confusing I'll be out of town for about 3-years, all my calls will be taken by End 80 or Mark.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 11:39:22 GMT
In the Seaweeds Tangled and Tripping Around
The title of this entry is a reflection of my own discomfort saying too much about power supplies, since some of what we're dealing with at this stage of Jim's installation is beyond my level of expertise.
Here's what I can figure out.
A. We are now talking about two different power supply situations... 1) the power for the AMT5000 and 2) the power supply for the RDL line amp.
We've got to deal with only one of them at a a time.
A_1 : The Power Supply for the AMT5000
With the RDL Line Amp NOT connected to power and the audio level control of the AMT5000 set CCW (audio off), connect the Original AMT5000 Power Supply Wall Wart to the 120VAC line previously wired out to the transmitter location.
Answer to Question: NO, you do NOT need to use both the voltage input and audio input of the J5 Connector Block. You can use one, the other, both, or neither. At the moment we are NOT talking about using the Voltage Input to J5... it is un-used in this present discussion.
With ONLY the AMT5000 powered up as instructed, do you get a normal carrier and quiet (no hum) audio from the transmitter? You should.
Let's stop here until Jim comes back to verify trying this process of determining that the AMT5000 is performing normally.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 13:52:28 GMT
Continuing with the STA-1M LINE AMP
The installation and testing of the STA-1M Line Amp should be tested INDEPENDENTLY from the AMT5000 Transmitter!!
Let's dissect Jim's post: "Here is an update. I wired the mixer as per Carl's instructions. I then wired the amp. I received the power supply in the mail yesterday. I just did the final hookup and noticed the power supply puts out 24 vdc and the STA-1 spec sheet calls for 12-15 vdc. Also the PS states that the line with the white stripe is positive. Well neither line has a white stripe, both are solid black so I cut off the connector and used my DMM to determine polarity. Anyway, everything hooked up, on my bench, and all I get on the radio is very loud 60 cycle hum. I'm done for today but I have a couple dozen power supplies laying around my shop so tomorrow I will look for one with a lower voltage output. That said, I'm not sure the PS is the problem. Does anyone know if you use the pro audio input that you must also use the power input on J5? I am still using the 5000's wall wart PS which I planned on housing in the enclosure when I mount it outside."
Jim said: "I just did the final hookup and noticed the power supply puts out 24 vdc and the STA-1 spec sheet calls for 12-15 vdc."
What "spec sheet"? I have a downloaded printed version which clearly says: 24 VDC Power Source.
Are you quoting a paper spec sheet that was shipped with the STA-1M?
Are you sure you have the right Line Amp?
Look at the Spec Sheet again... the voltage hookup for the 24 VDC is the left-side example labeled: GROUND NEGATIVE FOR GROUND-REFERENCED POWER INSTALLATION.... the drawing shows a jumper wire added (by you) between the negative voltage terminal and the ground terminal.
The right-side of the sheet shows an alternate BIPOLAR SUPPLY hookup which is marked 12V / 15 VDC and that is NOT what we are doing!!!!
ALSO When first wiring up the STA-1M TURN ITS VOLUME CONTROL CCW SO NO AMPLIFICATION OCCURS.
Test for audio with a Signal Tracer type device... a small audio amplifier with its own loudspeaker.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 14:16:46 GMT
POSSIBLE POINT OF CONFUSION EXPLAINED
The Audio Wiring drawings on the Spec Sheet show the BALANCED LINE side of the Amp with the 2 inner conductors connected but THE SHIELD NOT CONNECTED...... and the bold print says IT IS USUAL TO NOT CONNECT BALANCED OUTPUT SHIELD TO REDUCE GROUND LOOPS.
The problem with that part of the sheet is that it ASSUMES that anyone hooking up the circuit would have some professional knowledge about such things but we (you) are new to all this and it's a mystery to us (you).
What the spec sheet doesn't mention is that the shield connector of the balanced line SHOULD be attached to the ground terminal at the far end.... at the transmitter.... but for now we are testing the audio line NOT CONNECTED TO THE TRANSMITTER.
Later we may or may not want to attach the balanced line's shield at the STA-1M.
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 14, 2017 22:31:19 GMT
Carl, see my responses below. I will respond to each of your last 3 messages in order.In the Seaweeds Tangled and Tripping AroundThe title of this entry is a reflection of my own discomfort saying too much about power supplies, since some of what we're dealing with at this stage of Jim's installation is beyond my level of expertise. Here's what I can figure out. A. We are now talking about two different power supply situations... 1) the power for the AMT5000 and 2) the power supply for the RDL line amp. We've got to deal with only one of them at a a time. A_1 : The Power Supply for the AMT5000With the RDL Line Amp NOT connected to power and the audio level control of the AMT5000 set CCW (audio off), connect the Original AMT5000 Power Supply Wall Wart to the 120VAC line previously wired out to the transmitter location. Answer to Question: NO, you do NOT need to use both the voltage input and audio input of the J5 Connector Block. You can use one, the other, both, or neither. At the moment we are NOT talking about using the Voltage Input to J5... it is un-used in this present discussion. With ONLY the AMT5000 powered up as instructed, do you get a normal carrier and quiet (no hum) audio from the transmitter? You should. Yes I do. When I turn the gain up I still hear nothing Zara on my server. However, something has gone wrong with either Zara or my server. When I first logged into the server yesterday just to insure Zara was playing my play list. The audio from the server was distorted, halting, and breaking up. Windows update had just run as one possibility, but my first thoughts were this was a resource issue so I went through Task Mgr. and Services and shut down some processes and services that did not have to be running, and rebooted. Now, and I mean Sunday evening, Zara is running through the playlist with record speed, spending less than a second on each track and not playing ANY audio. Curiously, I have a few PAUSE 3 SECONDS in the playlist, and Zare DOES abide by that command, pausing for 3 seconds before continuing through the play list at record speed, playing no audio. Now yesterday after rebooting the server and restarting Zara, I went back to using the consumer audio input and all was fine.Let's stop here until Jim comes back to verify trying this process of determining that the AMT5000 is performing normally.
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 14, 2017 22:47:29 GMT
Continuing with the STA-1M LINE AMPThe installation and testing of the STA-1M Line Amp should be tested INDEPENDENTLY from the AMT5000 Transmitter!! Let's dissect Jim's post: " Here is an update. I wired the mixer as per Carl's instructions. I then wired the amp. I received the power supply in the mail yesterday. I just did the final hookup and noticed the power supply puts out 24 vdc and the STA-1 spec sheet calls for 12-15 vdc. Also the PS states that the line with the white stripe is positive. Well neither line has a white stripe, both are solid black so I cut off the connector and used my DMM to determine polarity. Anyway, everything hooked up, on my bench, and all I get on the radio is very loud 60 cycle hum. I'm done for today but I have a couple dozen power supplies laying around my shop so tomorrow I will look for one with a lower voltage output. That said, I'm not sure the PS is the problem. Does anyone know if you use the pro audio input that you must also use the power input on J5? I am still using the 5000's wall wart PS which I planned on housing in the enclosure when I mount it outside." Jim said: " I just did the final hookup and noticed the power supply puts out 24 vdc and the STA-1 spec sheet calls for 12-15 vdc." What "spec sheet"? I have a downloaded printed version which clearly says: 24 VDC Power Source. Are you quoting a paper spec sheet that was shipped with the STA-1M? Are you sure you have the right Line Amp? Carl, you are absolutely correct. I am using the spec sheet that came with the amp but it seems to be the same as the online one. I wired the amp correctly but I missed that jumper on the unbalanced line level source from - to GND. I also missed the 24 vdc reference and saw the 12 or 15 vdc on the right side of the sheet. I added that jumper and swapped in the 24 vdc source and yes I have the correct amp but now I see they list an optional jumper from GND on the unbalanced output to - of the power supply. Do I need to put that jumper in? (I really need to consider that cataract surgery the optometrist recommended to me a couple weeks ago!)
Look at the Spec Sheet again... the voltage hookup for the 24 VDC is the left-side example labeled: GROUND NEGATIVE FOR GROUND-REFERENCED POWER INSTALLATION.... the drawing shows a jumper wire added (by you) between the negative voltage terminal and the ground terminal. OK I guess that answers my previous question! I'll put that jumper in. I tend to take things literally so when the spec sheet says "optional", I figure I don't need it. The right-side of the sheet shows an alternate BIPOLAR SUPPLY hookup which is marked 12V / 15 VDC and that is NOT what we are doing!!!! ALSO When first wiring up the STA-1M TURN ITS VOLUME CONTROL CCW SO NO AMPLIFICATION OCCURS. Test for audio with a Signal Tracer type device... a small audio amplifier with its own loudspeaker. I have a signal tracer so I'll check that too.
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 14, 2017 23:22:40 GMT
See attached photo of how it's wired. POSSIBLE POINT OF CONFUSION EXPLAINEDThe Audio Wiring drawings on the Spec Sheet show the BALANCED LINE side of the Amp with the 2 inner conductors connected but THE SHIELD NOT CONNECTED...... and the bold print says IT IS USUAL TO NOT CONNECT BALANCED OUTPUT SHIELD TO REDUCE GROUND LOOPS. The problem with that part of the sheet is that it ASSUMES that anyone hooking up the circuit would have some professional knowledge about such things but we (you) are new to all this and it's a mystery to us (you). What the spec sheet doesn't mention is that the shield connector of the balanced line SHOULD be attached to the ground terminal at the far end.... at the transmitter.... but for now we are testing the audio line NOT CONNECTED TO THE TRANSMITTER. Later we may or may not want to attach the balanced line's shield at the STA-1M. Attachments:
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2017 23:50:31 GMT
Looks Like We Did Some Good
That really got me scared, Jim, when you talked about Zara going wacko!
(fingers crossed) I don't think anything we're doing on the audio system can interfere with the computer's ability to run programs.
From your answers (to this point) it sounds like we are getting things closer to launch.
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 15, 2017 0:37:05 GMT
I agree Carl. I have just rebooted the server again to see what happens. BTW I've also verified connectivity of the STP from the amp to the transmitter with an ohm meter. Not that I suspected it, but wanted to rule it out. Once I use the signal tracer if audio is not getting to the input of the amp I'll check everything in the mixer. However I was very careful with that and out of concern for shorts I covered everything with liquid electrical tape and then regular electrical tape. Looks Like We Did Some GoodThat really got me scared, Jim, when you talked about Zara going wacko! (fingers crossed) I don't think anything we're doing on the audio system can interfere with the computer's ability to run programs. From your answers (to this point) it sounds like we are getting things closer to launch.
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2017 13:39:05 GMT
Wiring Inspection and Optionals
I spent a couple of minutes eyeing the wiring of the Line Amp in the photo and it looks exactly right.
I have spent some moments pondering thoughts of Jim's words: "I tend to take things literally so when the spec sheet says "optional", I figure I don't need it."
So you'd think. But of course when there's an "option" than there is always a second "option", that being not to take the first option.
What I cannot explain because my electronics education falls short is when and why we might use a "floating" power supply.... that is, wiring the power supply to the +- terminals without grounding the negative side.
This would be a good time for someone to explain "floating" so we will better know our "options".
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Post by jimhenry2000 on May 15, 2017 20:59:33 GMT
Well it's now working! Not sure what I did. I poked around with the signal tracer and was getting tone everywhere I expected it. Still not working with the amp powered off, but this time (and I have done this several times before) when I powered up the amp I got programming on the radio! One thing I've noticed is the terminals on the amp often allow the wires to come loose, and this time I noticed one of the power leads dropped out when I moved the amp. Also, on the server I resolved the issue with Zara. I did recently install PcMatic on it but did not authorize Zara. So now, does anyone know how to adjust the gain on this amp? Yes I know where the gain control is. There is a Philips head screw on the top of the control, and a chrome tab sticking out the side of it. The best I can tell I have been unable to move it with either of these. In the meantime I will re-peak the RF tonight and perhaps install it tomorrow. Wiring Inspection and OptionalsI spent a couple of minutes eyeing the wiring of the Line Amp in the photo and it looks exactly right. I have spent some moments pondering thoughts of Jim's words: " I tend to take things literally so when the spec sheet says "optional", I figure I don't need it." So you'd think. But of course when there's an "option" than there is always a second "option", that being not to take the first option. What I cannot explain because my electronics education falls short is when and why we might use a "floating" power supply.... that is, wiring the power supply to the +- terminals without grounding the negative side. This would be a good time for someone to explain "floating" so we will better know our "options". Attachments:
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